We Are Selling with Lee Woodward
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We Are Selling with Lee Woodward
Ten Actions For Selling In A Changed Market. - Phil Harris.
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We share 10 practical actions that help agents and sellers navigate a changed Australian property market with clarity, evidence, and calm execution. We focus on trust, momentum, and measurable activity so price conversations and negotiations stay professional instead of emotional.
• Resetting seller expectations through better pre-market coaching and clearer campaign benchmarks
• Treating trust as the lever that creates speed when decisions get hard
• Maximising the first eight days with concentrated exposure, rapid feedback, and clear portal metrics
• Building a vendor communication rhythm with structured updates plus deeper “hyper” moments
• Making price a weekly agenda item using competing listings, recent sales, and forward planning
• Using a three-number framework to align buyer interest, seller expectations, and likely sale range
• Getting closure from every buyer enquiry to remove false hope and strengthen advice
• Turning views, saves, enquiries, inspections, and local comps into property-specific evidence
• Reverse engineering tough vendor conversations by drafting the email first and sending a written summary
• Repositioning mid-flight with a public price reset that creates leverage and fresh competition
• Reactivating the full buyer pool so negotiations never happen in isolation
• Leading with effort, confidence, and empathy while separating market shifts from agent performance
"I've got a one-page PDF for everyone to just pop in their booth, look at this, listen to this audio, and go, okay, am I doing any of that?"
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Welcome And Why We Are Selling
SPEAKER_00Hello and welcome back to the podcast. We are selling. Today we are doing 10 actions you can take in a changed market. And my guest speaker today came into a marketplace where things weren't simple and easy. And as a very young man entering the real estate world was not going well at the start and was sent to the complete salesperson course. This is your last chance. Good luck. And uh he rocked in, he said hello, and now runs one of our greatest real estate organizations in the country. I could only speak be speaking about one person, Mr. Phil Harris. Phil, welcome back to the program. Thank you, Lee.
SPEAKER_01Always uh a pleasure to connect. Thank
Phil’s Rough Start In Sales
SPEAKER_01you for having me.
SPEAKER_00Do you remember that day your first date, the complete salesperson?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I sure do. I'd reached that point in my life. A bit like a lot of other very successful salespeople when nothing else has worked out in your life. So someone suggests real estate. When you bought them out, that's the place to uh to turn, mate. What did you do before real estate? I was having to go at a professional sporting career, trying to be a tennis player. Uh had obviously hadn't worked out. So it's just been, you know, working very casually at uh 18, 19 years of age, just coaching some tennis. I was trying to work out what I want to do permanently long time. And my best friend's father, who was in car sales at that time during fleet sales, said if he had his time again, he would do real estate, said that was a good place to start. So I got out and plied in a number of roles, didn't quite get the gig, but then finally um yeah, took an apprenticeship. So that was my my pathway into property. And let's jump forward today.
Building A Major Adelaide Agency
SPEAKER_00Phil Harris Real Estate, big organization for our people in the UK that may not know of the organization. Where are you today? How many salespeople, how many officers?
SPEAKER_01So we trade in the largely the Metro region of Adelaide. Mind you, we have got some lifestyle markets that we tap into. So Adelaide, South Australia, across the group, Lee, we're about, uh, I think we're a little shy, 350 employees. I think we, as far as salespeople go, I think we've got about 150 salespeople, and that may uh that also on top of that, probably some support staff, things like co-agents and team managers. The business these days, we sell about three and a half thousand homes per year, uh, and just a little over six thousand properties under management. So it's a it's a very different business lead to um what it was when we first started 16 years ago.
SPEAKER_00That is a lot of doors, and claiming doors is all this industry is about. And Phil, today you've agreed to work on the the change market 10 actions that move property owners and agents forward. So let's get started. We've
Reset Seller Expectations Early
SPEAKER_00number one, reset the seller's expectations. We need to prepare the owners for the market. They are entering, not the market they remember. Phil, what's your team doing with this at the moment?
SPEAKER_01I think in a changing or changing/slash change property market, I think it's one of the most critical strategies or com strategies, I should say, or conversations that a success successful agents are going to have. I think that this is where there's a lot more heavy lifting. And I think in any marketplace, like there are still some basic consistencies that will always remain the same. However, in different markets, you just need to pivot and spend more time in certain areas. So when a market is very, very strong, it's all about prospecting because if you get it listed, you'll get it sold. However, the marketplace that we're now in, there's just a lot more work that needs to be spent in that time frame between I've got the listing and I'm launching the property maybe in 14 days' time. It's that period where I'm yeah, very much in a lot of coaching with our team now about resetting expectations, resetting strategy, and really putting very clear parameters in place for homeowners around what are the metrics, KPIs, and what are the things that we need to be seeing occurring by kind of day seven, day 14 on market. And if we're not hitting those benchmarks by a particular time frame, what what are the actions and the strategies we're gonna put in place?
SPEAKER_00Couldn't agree more. And a great question to the owners right now is John and Helen, with everything you know now going on in the world and the changed marketplace of the Australian real estate industry, why have you chosen now to put the property on the market? And I think, Phil, getting to the truth on that answer is gonna allow us to explain the current buyer behaviour and these changing conditions and discuss realistic time frames and likely campaign scenarios that allow us to establish that price alignment that may be required straight away. So conducting seller school and the setup to sell has become more important than ever.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I and I'd also add to that, Lee, as well. And so I think that ultimately depth of trust is what enables speed in a marketplace. And I think that, you know, the last five years post-COVID became very, very transactionalistic, get it sold for a great price. Whereas now I'm really encouraging our team, put in that extra time to actually really develop the relationship with the owner. So before you go to market, they can see that you're a human being, they can see that you care because there's going to come a time where it's not going to be about the process, the system, or the dialogue. There's going to come a moment where they actually have to trust you. And so when you've got that trust, you say now's the time to move that offer. You've actually got that relationship to do it.
SPEAKER_00Action
Make The First Eight Days Count
SPEAKER_00number two, make the first eight days count. The opening stage of the campaign provides the clearest market evidence. Phil, I see a lot of people saying, Oh, you know, in the first week, two weeks, that's a long time. We know from the metrics of the portals, the first eight days it hits the portal is the heat on the property, and we've got to look at that response. And this is why the coming soon campaign is separate to that. I'm saying the first eight days of live to the market, but let's make sure we're doing all we can to, in the pre-market, find out that buyer engagement level.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I I really like this one, Lee. As you know, I don't I don't sell a whole lot of properties these days, and I I've still occasionally get in every year. I'll still do a handful of sales where you know the key clients, friends, family, whatever it might be. And I'm I'm actually about to launch one this coming Thursday. So once again, timely. Well, I've got a real strategy at the moment around absolute maximum exposure, but also maximum feedback to that owner in that first kind of eight to ten day period. And so I'm also noticing with some of the other really high quality agents across the country, it's not unusual to see agents now doing their pre-market or or off-market off portal. On so, for example, I'm doing that on a Thursday night, and then we're reopening that the actual kickoff of this property. We're doing open homes on Saturday, Sunday, Monday, and Tuesday. So it's a very hyper-intensive launch to the property. So we are going to get that immediate feedback, and there can't be a conversation about you haven't opened it, we haven't had enough people through. It's just increasing the rep so the owner actually gets the correct feedback on their property.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I love it. So launch with maximum market intensity, contact every potential buyer immediately, measure the inspections, inquiries, and saves and buyer feedback. You know, 42 people have saved the property. That means it's not price aligned for them. And recognize that a property can can age quickly in a market like we're in now.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and and this is where it's become for the actual listing conversation or that moment between kind of listed and launched, where you're going back and actually you're realigning your owner to actually get on board with the strategy, to actually talk them through. This is where I'm going to be doing sending an SMS to my buyer database. This is when the pre-market viewing is going to be. Then there's going to be an audience maximizer product that's launched on realestate.com, then the normal listing. And then it's going to be released in the paper. And so you're really starting to work towards this pinnacle. And then combining that with a hyper open exposure really sets it up in the right position.
SPEAKER_00Action
A Vendor Communication Rhythm
SPEAKER_00number three, establish a vendor communication system. Never leave an owner wondering what is happening. Set a minimum of five communication points each week. Confirm a specific weekly call appointment. So never just say you're going to call Monday. I'll call you Monday between 5.15 and 6. Provide written reports midweek and increase communication when activity on negotiations intensifies. That is action three. What's your response, Phil?
SPEAKER_01I think it's a blend of what I would call standardized communications. Every single great agent, you should have a communication rhythm, which is exactly that, Lean. You know, and some people have got their own person, their own preference to that. But the actual structured time of when you do your, I mean, I was always a daily communicator when I was selling a home for summer, either quick call, quick SMS. There'd also be a weekly marketplace report. There'd also be a weekly face-to-face meeting. Now technology has changed that. Some of that's via Zoom or Teams. But there's always a daily communication. So I think that the key rule for me around communication right now, you've got structured communication, but now I'd also make sure you've got strategies of what I would call hyper-exaggerated communication. So you've kind of got this backbone of structure, which is here's my daily call, my weekly marketplace, my face-to-face, whatever that might be. But then there are certain moments and certain touch points where you've got to go far deeper, such as if you've an interested party, there should be more time spent on the phone or face-to-face explaining where the buyer is up to, explaining how many other properties that that buyer has actually looked at, why they haven't bought, properties they've bid on. So you've got structure, and there should be some exaggerated moments where in this marketplace you're taking a deeper dive on communication.
Talk Price Weekly Without Drama
SPEAKER_00Well, that beautifully aligns to action number four. Discuss price every week. Price should be a normal business conversation, not a crisis conversation. Introduce price alignment from the beginning, review price against inquiry, inspections, and offers, forecast adjustments before they are required. And Phil, you'll remember that from the complete salesperson course where we say, I don't want to drop it now. But by the 20th, if we haven't got the result we need, we'll need to improve the price and go to our next audience and agree on these review dates and possible new price levels.
SPEAKER_01And I'd even go one step further on and say if you're starting to discuss price into the campaign, it's too late. Like the preventative is always better than the cure. So I think obviously at the listing appointment, you're going to talk directly about what's on the market, what's being sold, market conditions. And I think that a uh weekly agenda item, you should be discussing every single property that is currently on the market that is competing, and every single property that has sold in the last seven days. And if you don't know that off the top of your head, then you are absolutely behind the eight ball. So you need to be that absolute product knowledge champion on everything that is transacting because you can't let owners get away with saying, well, that property there at 26 Mystery, they're asking 3.6 for that. And you've got to be able to rebut that, Lee, and say, well, actually, yeah, I get it. That's now been on the market for 67 days. It also started at 3.9, and that one isn't transacting. So you've got to have that product knowledge to be able to do that. I think it's a weekly agenda item. And I love what you said, Lee. It's always about positioning, which is we're going to run the property at this price guide for this particular price frame, time frame, I should say. However, if we're still in this position, Lee, this time next week, then um I don't want to do this, but obviously we're going to need to have a conversation about the price if we're still here with these metrics. So all about forward planning, all about getting ahead.
SPEAKER_00I've had a lot of agents using the three price strategy. And just to explain that, we say to our owners, each week, I need your consent to be direct with you on what's happening with price. And there's three numbers we need to review. The first one is the buyer engagement level. You know, the greatest homes in Australia remained unsold due to price. And there is a price where the buyer is interested and not, and I'll report back to you on that number. The second number is your own. You'll have an expectation, Mr. Harris, each week that you're on the market of what you feel it's going to go for, it should go for. I know when I was selling my home, I had expectations and they change each week based upon the feedback. But the third number is where I think it's going to sell for. And this is where I need your consent to say to you, if we were setting a reserve today, or if you ask me, Lee, what's going to pull it up? I want to tell you that number based upon where we are within the market. And if we could do that and discuss that, you're going to be able to make an informed decision. And I think that Phil just wraps up for nicely and brings us into action number five. Get
Close Out Every Buyer Lead
SPEAKER_00oh, this is so important. Action number five, get closure from every buyer inquiry. Incomplete buyer follow-up creates false hope and weakens your advice. Categorize each buyer as active, progressing, withdrawn, or cold. Record the specific reason interest did not continue, and report competing purchases and withdrawn interest. Never leave an owner asking what happened to that buyer.
SPEAKER_01I think if the agent, if sorry, if the vendor is asking what happened to the buyer, then you actually failed. You haven't done your job. And I remember at AREC going back a good few years ago, Lee Gav Rugenstein gave a presentation when he spoke about vendor management. He said it's a little bit like walking down a hallway of like a if you can imagine kind of a hotel hallway, and you've got all of these rooms or doorways, I should say, on either side of the hallway, and they're all open doors. And that vendor management process, you've got to walk down that hallway. And as you walk past each door, you've got to make sure that door is closed because an open door just leaves an option for an owner to not actually move forward because you haven't actually tied it down and shut it off. And that's exactly what open buyers leads to. So the moment that you leave a glimmer of hope with an owner, which is, you know, Jenny and John Smith, who came through and you've been lazy in your approach, you've left the door open, you haven't actually said, well, actually, you know, they're actually not interested and they've actually bought elsewhere, or actually they're just a neighbor and they're not a buyer. If there is that glimmer of hope there and they're putting false hope in a non-genuine buyer, you are only prolonging their ability to move forward with the required information to actually make an appropriate sale.
SPEAKER_00When you're doing your buyer management and they say, Oh, Lee, thanks for your help. We bought off LJ Hooker on Saturday. Which one did you buy? Because your owner's about to go past that sold sign and say, My home's better than that. And we need to be able to report back that the lady Robin that I brought through the property who had genuine interest, she's now purchased for 50,000 less from LJ Hooker on Saturday, but you did see your own home. Otherwise, they think it's an agent issue, not a buyer issue. Number
Turn Data Into Clear Evidence
SPEAKER_00six, turn market data into evidence. Your recommendations must be supported by facts rather than opinion. Track online views, saves, inquiries, and inspections, compare the property with the current and recently sold listings, show owners where buyers are engaging, and remove every possible obstacle until the remaining issue becomes clear.
SPEAKER_01This week we've got sales meetings around our offices. Lee and I was chatting with other officers today about the importance of um having granular data specific to the property that you're selling because too much of the broad headline data is actually non-relevant to the homeowner that you're specifically selling for. So I think there's the importance of the actual uh actionable data around the property in terms of downloads, clicks, saves, shares, and all of those sorts of things. But then you do need to be 100% granular around the specific data of the property on that street. So what's happening in Adelaide at a median sale price has no relevance to what's happening to a four-bedroom, two-bar friend contemporary home at Sumberton Park. You need to know that that marketplace for that price range is down 8.7% on the last 12 months. And if you don't know that, you're going to allow lukewarm throwaway conversations from owners dictating the conversation or the campaign, such as, oh yeah, but you know, my neighbor, two streets over. I mean, they sell for two, four, five. So what do you mean we're at 2.3? You can't allow just those throwaway conversations to be able to dictate, and you need the information to be able to combat that.
Script Hard Calls Then Summarise
SPEAKER_00Well, that brings us to action number seven, reverse engineered conversations. Prepare the evidence before having a difficult conversation with a vendor, draft the follow-up email before making the call, assemble the buyer feedback, online activity and market comparisons, use the prepared information to guide the conversation, and then send the written summary immediately afterwards. And Phil, you taught you were taught this very early that you draft this brilliant email, you read from it as you're making your phone call, give it a few moments. Helen, we've discussed a lot of information today. Let me send you a summary of what we discussed. They receive it very professional. If the partner of the person says, Oh, have we heard from Phil today? Yes, we have, what did he say? Uh he's detailed it in an email, and it's it's then a recorded evidence rather than just an evaporated set of words on the on the phone.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I really like it, Lee. And this goes back to we we spoke about in in some of the earlier ticket items that we're working through here today. I said that, you know, you need to have some level of hyper-exaggerated communication strategy. And this is what I would classically call one of those. So you've got daily telephone call updates, weekly marketplace reports, plus you've got, you know, weekly face-to-face meeting. But this is just another layer of exaggerated communication that I would say most people over the last kind of five years in in the strong property market that we've had, like this tool of kind of being put on the sideline and it hasn't been necessary. If you could make a quick call, didn't really need price adjustments, properties got sold. Whereas having this extra layer of communication in a very structured format, because there's a formula to getting a price sold. We know the three levers of price presentation and marketing. We know that they will always be the three blockers to a sale. So let's actually have some premeditated strategy around it. So I love that one. I think it's a great idea to talk through what's the format of that letter that goes out, talks about the activity that you've had on the property so far, what the expectations were, what your recommendations are moving forward. You have that telephone conversation and you send it out. So I think that's a great strategy. I also think that video messages, Lee, that's another one, which is once again, you can have that conversation, you can summarize it in a uh selfie video, flick that through. These are little tools that all the great agents are using out there right now.
Reposition Mid-Flight With Authority
SPEAKER_00And Phil, number eight is actually my favorite of these 10 key actions. And number eight is reposition the property mid-flight. And the mid-flight price reduction is to use a genuine offer or engagement level to publicly reset the campaign, obtain the owner's authority to adjust the published guide, reposition the property at the level where buyers are engaging, demonstrate to the current buyer that their offer is being considered, and broadcast the new opportunity to create competition. So when an owner says, All right, I'll take this, okay, well, let me put some upward pressure on the purchaser. I'm going to change it on realestate.com. That's going to notify everyone who's been following it, but I'll go back to the purchaser at a at the acceptance price, which is our new public price, and that may just get us above what you're hoping to achieve. Are you okay for me to proceed with that plan? And the mid-flight price reduction, even if that offer doesn't go ahead, we've had a movement. Yeah, I absolutely love it, Lee.
SPEAKER_01It's a sign of a proactive, creative agent who's doing everything they possibly can. And the vendor not only feels it, but it's a reality of an agent who's actually trying everything they possibly can to protect the price and get the best possible outcome. And right at the start, we spoke about saying, you know, in this marketplace, like depth of trust is what creates the speed to bring a deal together. And so when an agent goes to an owner, says, Look, I know you're not prepared to take, you know, 1.45. You know, we're currently on the market at 1675 or something like that. But here's my recommendation. Although I agree, I don't want to sell for 1475, but I think our best chance at doing better, what I'd like to do with your approval, I really want to create some leverage and some competition, some pressure on this buyer to actually step up because I think they can get more. How about we go to market at 155 or 1595, whatever the compet uh whatever the price guide is that you agree on? But I'm actually just developing greater levels of trust here because I'm being proactive and showing them that I'm doing everything I can to move this buyer. So I think it's a great strategy. Well set.
Reactivate Buyers And Create Competition
SPEAKER_00Number nine, reactivate the entire buyer market. Do not negotiate with one buyer in isolation. Notify every past inquiry and inspection and attendee. Announce the new price and imminent sale. Contact all buyers who save the property online, use urgency to bring outstanding interest back into play. So, Phil, you know my thoughts on this from the course. That, you know, I'd have nothing on a property, but a stack of people had seen it. I just do a bulk text saying, Thank you for visiting 20 Prescott Avenue. We are submitting all offers on that property today. Please let me know if you would like to submit an offer. And you'd be amazed who would come back saying, Well, I saw that weeks ago, and I've seen nothing else good since. What do you think it's going to go for? Because sometimes people, they're the buyer, they just saw it at the wrong time. They saw it too early. And to reactivate the market is a very powerful thing in buyer management.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, I I love it. I mean, we call it competition selling, in essence, you know, never do anything in isolation, try and create competition. I think that there, you know, and there's even deeper levels of this. If you know you're going to be writing up an offer with a buyer, it's not uncommon for our better agents. If you're going to write that offer up at the property, well, if I'm meeting a buyer there to have a, you know, a second look at the property whilst I make another offer, you can change the open time online and do an open there at 4 p.m., put a flag up, get an SMS out to every single attendee, get an SMS out to every single inquiry, you know, so that the buyer who's writing up an offer, there's multiple people coming for an open home and Jeff trying to create a sense of competition around the property. And that's what great agents are doing, Lee. They're being more proactive. It takes more work, it takes more effort, but these are the tools that are required to get deals done in this marketplace.
SPEAKER_00And just to add to number nine, at least the love ringing in buyers from two years ago and say, Hi Phil, Lee Woodward, you came. To 20 Prescott Avenue two years ago. Did you end up moving? They go, No. It was all too hard. They were selling so fast, wasting your time at the auction. Well, Phil, great news. You couldn't get a better time to buy on the planet right now. What does your current house not have that you need in the new place? Tell me about your next house. What does it have to have? Oh, our daughter's 19. We've got to get a granny flat or a dungeon or some sort of separate space. We're all under the one roof. Look, I've got something like that. Would you be open to seeing it? And I'd bring people back into play who were in a fast market and just gave up. And you bring them back into something like this and they go, hey, this is we could make this work. And I think, as you just said, Phil, that's what good agents do. They they bring the marriage back together. But the active market may not be your buyer. It could be the season data that you bring back into play, and you'll know who they are. You got on with them so well. You know their names, they know your names. They're probably a real record in your phone and a great way to pull sales together when the inquiry market is confused. Fuel
Lead With Empathy And Confidence
SPEAKER_00number 10. Lead with effort, confidence, and empathy. Agents earn the right to recommend change by demonstrating that everything possible has been done. Judge the campaign by controllable actions, not emotion. Own genuine mistakes and correct them quickly. And do not accept blame for changes created by the market. Remain calm, empathetic, and confident when owners are under pressure.
SPEAKER_01I absolutely love it, Lee. I think um I mean great agents have confidence because they know that they're good at what they do. Even one of the key points there you've got, Lee, is you know, do not accept blame for changes created by the marketplace. I know that, you know, sometimes an owner will say, Oh, hang on, Phil, you know, you said that we were going to get 4.4. And so, well, you know, I I know I did and I got it wrong. But guess what? The other three agents that you called out to appraise the property, they got it wrong as well, and so did you, because the market's not where it is right now. Now, the easy thing for me to do is just to roll over and say, hey, you know, let's just play on and maybe we'll be there in two weeks, three weeks, four weeks' time. Or the professional conversation is we now need to make a change to actually get your property sold so you can move on. So there's a whole range of things there, Lee. But I think if you've got depth of relationship, you actually execute flawlessly on the promises that were made at the listing presentation in relation to process as well as strategy. And if you do that and you've had honest conversations, then you have earned the right to give clear direction as to how they should go about navigating the sale, irrespective of where price feedback may or may not be based on their expectations.
One-Page PDF And Buyer Coaching
SPEAKER_00Well, Phil, we've nailed the top 10 actions in our show notes. I've got a one-page PDF for everyone to just pop in their booth, look at this, listen to this audio, and go, okay, am I doing any of that? Could I do one of those things? If you did all 10, uh, this soon too will pass, the marketplace will move on. Also remember that you've got to coach the buyer to make an offer. They're confused and they're actually one thing I'm doing at the moment, Phil, is teaching people that dialogue where you where a buyer's coming in aggressive on the offer, and you just park the buyer and say, look, before you mention any any numbers, putting price aside, is this really the home that you want to buy? And what's it gonna give you that you don't have in your current situation? And there's even an arm movement, Phil. I'm gonna show you because you're on Zoom, where putting price aside, putting price aside, I've got everyone learning that moment movement at the moment. Uh, but when you say, look, putting price aside, or even when you're presenting in a listing presentation, putting fees aside, is Harris the real estate group you want representing you, or are you attracted to that person working in their bedroom by themselves? What do you want? Putting fees aside, and it's just a great way of putting that fork in the road to make all this come together. So, Phil, that gives us our 10 actions. The one pager is there in the show notes, a little PDF to print out and get you through this marketplace. And Phil Harris, thank you for joining us. Thank you, lady.